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Man hurt in A36 crash
ROADBLOCKS are in place after a three-vehicle crash on the A36 near Warminster.
One man has been taken to Salisbury District Hospital following a collision between Crockerton roundabout and Heytesbury roundabout on the Warminster bypass shortly before 1pm.
The man had to be cut free from his heavy goods vehicle by the emergency services.
The incident involved a white Vauxhall Astra and two goods vehicles, one of which was driven by the injured man.
The crash comes just days after the Wiltshire Times published startling statistics about the number of crashes on the A36 stretch of road through Wiltshire on which six people have died in the last year.
In the latest collision, the section of the A36 will be blocked for at least the next 30 minutes.
2:02pm Tuesday 25th March 2008
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CommentPosted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 5:36am Wed 26 Mar 08
Any accident on the A36 or anywhere else is bad news, but at least this one appears to be without any fatalities.
I've always regarded the stretch of A36 between Heytesbury roundabout and the Crockerton roundabout as relatively safe because there are several safe over-taking lanes which are not shared with traffic coming the other way (unlike the utterly crazy situation on the Black Dog Hill section of the A36 where traffic going both ways uses the same middle lane for over-taking).
Also, there is a quite long straight stretch where, if no traffic is coming the other way, one can see a long way ahead to safely overtake.
The really insane part of the A36 is Black Dog Hill due to the overtaking allowed both ways in a middle lane.
I believe the section between the Codford turn-offs is an accident blackspot, but this is more due to drivers being stupid and ignoring the white lines to keep in lane rather than an issue with a shared overtaking lane (as there isn't one).
Any accident on the A36 or anywhere else is bad news, but at least this one appears to be without any fatalities.
I've always regarded the stretch of A36 between Heytesbury roundabout and the Crockerton roundabout as relatively safe because there are several safe over-taking lanes which are not shared with traffic coming the other way (unlike the utterly crazy situation on the Black Dog Hill section of the A36 where traffic going both ways uses the same middle lane for over-taking).
Also, there is a quite long straight stretch where, if no traffic is coming the other way, one can see a long way ahead to safely overtake.
The really insane part of the A36 is Black Dog Hill due to the overtaking allowed both ways in a middle lane.
I believe the section between the Codford turn-offs is an accident blackspot, but this is more due to drivers being stupid and ignoring the white lines to keep in lane rather than an issue with a shared overtaking lane (as there isn't one).
Posted by: Paul, Warminster on 8:02am Wed 26 Mar 08
Hello, when did you last drive down that stretch of road. It has the same silly idea as Blackdog, where both sides can overtake using the same middle lane. Also the long straight stretch has a lay-by near the end which is also an accident waiting to happen. Why overtake anyway cause you probably wont get to your destination much quicker but could end yours or someone elses life earlier.
Hello, when did you last drive down that stretch of road. It has the same silly idea as Blackdog, where both sides can overtake using the same middle lane. Also the long straight stretch has a lay-by near the end which is also an accident waiting to happen. Why overtake anyway cause you probably wont get to your destination much quicker but could end yours or someone elses life earlier.
Posted by: realistic old man, West wilts on 8:39am Wed 26 Mar 08
One of the touted benefits of Gatso cameras is that, far from being a revenue raising operation, they help to reduce accidents at notorious black spots - how many cameras are there on the Warminster by-pass and Black Dog Hill?
Precisely none.
I rest my case
One of the touted benefits of Gatso cameras is that, far from being a revenue raising operation, they help to reduce accidents at notorious black spots - how many cameras are there on the Warminster by-pass and Black Dog Hill?
Precisely none.
I rest my case
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 9:06am Wed 26 Mar 08
[bold]Paul[/bold] said:
[quote]when did you last drive down that stretch of road. It has the same silly idea as Blackdog, where both sides can overtake using the same middle lane.[/quote]
Paul
I've been along that road thousands of times. There is NO shared middle lane to talk about at all.
YES, there are overtaking lanes for each side, but they are NOT shared in the same way as at Black Dog Hill because the double white lines are there to stop the traffic on the far side going into the overtaking lane.
At Black Dog Hill, there is no double white line, so traffic going both ways uses the uphill climber lane.
I agree that any junction on a road, including laybys, is a hazard that drivers should watch for in the same way as any other junction when looking for places to overtake.
Paul said:
when did you last drive down that stretch of road. It has the same silly idea as Blackdog, where both sides can overtake using the same middle lane.
Paul
I've been along that road thousands of times. There is NO shared middle lane to talk about at all.
YES, there are overtaking lanes for each side, but they are NOT shared in the same way as at Black Dog Hill because the double white lines are there to stop the traffic on the far side going into the overtaking lane.
At Black Dog Hill, there is no double white line, so traffic going both ways uses the uphill climber lane.
I agree that any junction on a road, including laybys, is a hazard that drivers should watch for in the same way as any other junction when looking for places to overtake.
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 9:15am Wed 26 Mar 08
[quote][bold]realistic old man[/bold] wrote:
One of the touted benefits of Gatso cameras is that, far from being a revenue raising operation, they help to reduce accidents at notorious black spots - how many cameras are there on the Warminster by-pass and Black Dog Hill? Precisely none. I rest my case[/quote] The Gatso at the top of Black Dog Hill got burnt out twice and was removed.
I do not think it would have had much effect on traffic overtaking further down the hill using the middle lane as traffic doing 60mph still wants to overtake slower traffic and will want to use the middle lane on the hill as soon as the driver sees the middle lane.
The really idiotic thing about Black Dog Hill is the fact that traffic going both ways can go into the same middle lane with no warning that whilst you are in it cars coming the other way can enter it too. Clearly, downhill traffic is supposed to give way to uphill traffic on the middle lane, but it is exceedingly dangerous to assume that drivers will see each other coming towards them and that the downhill driver will remember and be able to suddenly pull in out of the way.
realistic old man wrote:
One of the touted benefits of Gatso cameras is that, far from being a revenue raising operation, they help to reduce accidents at notorious black spots - how many cameras are there on the Warminster by-pass and Black Dog Hill? Precisely none. I rest my case
The Gatso at the top of Black Dog Hill got burnt out twice and was removed.
I do not think it would have had much effect on traffic overtaking further down the hill using the middle lane as traffic doing 60mph still wants to overtake slower traffic and will want to use the middle lane on the hill as soon as the driver sees the middle lane.
The really idiotic thing about Black Dog Hill is the fact that traffic going both ways can go into the same middle lane with no warning that whilst you are in it cars coming the other way can enter it too. Clearly, downhill traffic is supposed to give way to uphill traffic on the middle lane, but it is exceedingly dangerous to assume that drivers will see each other coming towards them and that the downhill driver will remember and be able to suddenly pull in out of the way.
Posted by: walter, wilshur on 9:29am Wed 26 Mar 08
Its the most dangerous form of travel apart from NASA shuttle. Hundreds killed every month on the roads - when did yopu last see a British Airways fatality?
Its the most dangerous form of travel apart from NASA shuttle. Hundreds killed every month on the roads - when did yopu last see a British Airways fatality?
Posted by: Paul, Warminster on 11:01am Wed 26 Mar 08
Russell,
I travel on this stretch of road every working day and there IS a stretch of overtaking madness under one of the bridges. I witness on almost a daily basis stupid drivers overtaking the same as they do on Blackdog. As we all know a Gatso may stop them speeding but it will not stop them overtaking and the Gatso will probually get torched as soon as its erected like the one on Blackdog.
Russell,
I travel on this stretch of road every working day and there IS a stretch of overtaking madness under one of the bridges. I witness on almost a daily basis stupid drivers overtaking the same as they do on Blackdog. As we all know a Gatso may stop them speeding but it will not stop them overtaking and the Gatso will probually get torched as soon as its erected like the one on Blackdog.
Posted by: mark_wilts, Melksham on 12:04pm Wed 26 Mar 08
Is there not any way you could upgrade the Warminster Bypass / Blackdog Hill to Dual Carriageway? Also, heard that there was talk of a Bath - Beckington improvement Scheme, how about bringing that one back and extending it to Warminster?
Is there not any way you could upgrade the Warminster Bypass / Blackdog Hill to Dual Carriageway? Also, heard that there was talk of a Bath - Beckington improvement Scheme, how about bringing that one back and extending it to Warminster?
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 12:33pm Wed 26 Mar 08
[quote][bold]Paul[/bold] wrote:
Russell, I travel on this stretch of road every working day and there IS a stretch of overtaking madness under one of the bridges. I witness on almost a daily basis stupid drivers overtaking the same as they do on Blackdog. As we all know a Gatso may stop them speeding but it will not stop them overtaking and the Gatso will probually get torched as soon as its erected like the one on Blackdog.[/quote] Paul
There may well be some over-taking madness on the stretch under the bridge, but this is not the same as what happens on Black Dog Hill.
Going towards Heytesbury coming up to the bridge is an over-taking lane designated only for eastwards traffic where some cars get in at the last second. But there is very little traffic from the other direction also using the same lane because there is a double white line stopping them and they have only just reached the end of their own overtaking lane.
The difference with Black Dog Hill is that traffic in both directions use the same middle lane without any warning or double white lines that traffic from the opposite direction might suddenly come out and use it.
Paul wrote:
Russell, I travel on this stretch of road every working day and there IS a stretch of overtaking madness under one of the bridges. I witness on almost a daily basis stupid drivers overtaking the same as they do on Blackdog. As we all know a Gatso may stop them speeding but it will not stop them overtaking and the Gatso will probually get torched as soon as its erected like the one on Blackdog.
Paul
There may well be some over-taking madness on the stretch under the bridge, but this is not the same as what happens on Black Dog Hill.
Going towards Heytesbury coming up to the bridge is an over-taking lane designated only for eastwards traffic where some cars get in at the last second. But there is very little traffic from the other direction also using the same lane because there is a double white line stopping them and they have only just reached the end of their own overtaking lane.
The difference with Black Dog Hill is that traffic in both directions use the same middle lane without any warning or double white lines that traffic from the opposite direction might suddenly come out and use it.
Posted by: Paul, Warminster on 12:47pm Wed 26 Mar 08
Russell,
I'm sorry to all the other readers,but, you are WRONG, get in your car and have a drive around the VERY busy Warminster bypass and then say its not busy and that there is no overtaking the same as Blackdog. Its the same and its makes me annoyed when people like you think they know it all and dont take notice of the locals.
Russell,
I'm sorry to all the other readers,but, you are WRONG, get in your car and have a drive around the VERY busy Warminster bypass and then say its not busy and that there is no overtaking the same as Blackdog. Its the same and its makes me annoyed when people like you think they know it all and dont take notice of the locals.
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 4:41pm Wed 26 Mar 08
Paul
I fully accept that mad over-taking occurs anywhere, including the subject stretch of the A36 between Heytesbury and Crockerton roundabouts.
The problem here seems to be your inability to understand the fact that this stretch of road is [bold]NOT[/bold] the same as Black Dog Hill [bold]BECAUSE[/bold] it does [bold]NOT[/bold] have the joint two-way middle over-taking lane which does exist at Black Dog Hill.
Yes, middle over-taking lanes exist on the subject stretch of the A36, but they are nowhere near as dangerous because they are not used by traffic going both ways as there are double white lines which work to say that the middle lane is for traffic going the other way only.
I'm sorry that you are unable to understand this. I'm sorry but I have it exactly correct and you obviously can't see what is actually in the road.
I give up on explaining it to you and will not be answering you again if you wish just to make a pointless and incorrect contradiction again.
Paul
I fully accept that mad over-taking occurs anywhere, including the subject stretch of the A36 between Heytesbury and Crockerton roundabouts.
The problem here seems to be your inability to understand the fact that this stretch of road is
NOT the same as Black Dog Hill
BECAUSE it does
NOT have the joint two-way middle over-taking lane which does exist at Black Dog Hill.
Yes, middle over-taking lanes exist on the subject stretch of the A36, but they are nowhere near as dangerous because they are not used by traffic going both ways as there are double white lines which work to say that the middle lane is for traffic going the other way only.
I'm sorry that you are unable to understand this. I'm sorry but I have it exactly correct and you obviously can't see what is actually in the road.
I give up on explaining it to you and will not be answering you again if you wish just to make a pointless and incorrect contradiction again.
Posted by: GreatUnwashed, The Laundrette on 8:31pm Wed 26 Mar 08
Russell,
I agree with Paul, the section between Crockerton and Heytesbury does have 3 lanes which both directions can use. I think you are confusing this with the other section between Crockerton and Longleat roundabouts which does have the double white lines and alternate overtaking lanes.
Russell,
I agree with Paul, the section between Crockerton and Heytesbury does have 3 lanes which both directions can use. I think you are confusing this with the other section between Crockerton and Longleat roundabouts which does have the double white lines and alternate overtaking lanes.
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 8:53pm Wed 26 Mar 08
OK folks
I've just got back from a trip which involved going along the relevant section and, to my amazement, I saw that Paul is perfectly correct.
Sorry, Paul. I take it all back and bow low to your better memory of the road in this section.
I was thinking of the section travelling eastwards between the Cley Hill roundabout and Crockerton roundabout where the middle over-taking lane for the westwards traffic coming from Crockerton roundabout also has no double white lines.
What I've now seen is that the overtaking lane for eastwards traffic on the subject section has no white lines too. This allows traffic going towards Heytesbury (westwards) to use the same middle lane despite oncoming traffic using it as their over-taking lane.
That is extremely dangerous and is the same situation as at Black Dog Hill.
I'll slink away quietly now .....
OK folks
I've just got back from a trip which involved going along the relevant section and, to my amazement, I saw that Paul is perfectly correct.
Sorry, Paul. I take it all back and bow low to your better memory of the road in this section.
I was thinking of the section travelling eastwards between the Cley Hill roundabout and Crockerton roundabout where the middle over-taking lane for the westwards traffic coming from Crockerton roundabout also has no double white lines.
What I've now seen is that the overtaking lane for eastwards traffic on the subject section has no white lines too. This allows traffic going towards Heytesbury (westwards) to use the same middle lane despite oncoming traffic using it as their over-taking lane.
That is extremely dangerous and is the same situation as at Black Dog Hill.
I'll slink away quietly now .....
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 8:54pm Wed 26 Mar 08
Oops - I meant to say "double white lines" in my penultimate paragraph above.
Oops - I meant to say "double white lines" in my penultimate paragraph above.
Posted by: Russell Hawker, WESTBURY on 11:55am Thu 27 Mar 08
In the spirit of accuracy, I had better correct myself again.
My post above at 8:53pm Wed 26 Mar 08 requires further correction.
It was my last but two paragraph which needed to refer to double white lines.
Also, traffic coming from Heytesbury towards the Crockerton roundabout is going westwards not eastwards.
Traffic going eastwards from the Crockerton roundabout towards Heytesbury has its own overtaking lane as the bridge is approached. This does have a double white line to stop traffic coming the other way using it too.
BUT, as Paul correctly pointed ouit in the first place, eastwards traffic passing under the bridge then sees ahead of it the over-taking lane for traffic coming the other way, but there is no double white line stopping eastwards traffic from using it too.
I'll have a lie down now .... and try to keep my fingers off the keyboard for a bit ....
In the spirit of accuracy, I had better correct myself again.
My post above at 8:53pm Wed 26 Mar 08 requires further correction.
It was my last but two paragraph which needed to refer to double white lines.
Also, traffic coming from Heytesbury towards the Crockerton roundabout is going westwards not eastwards.
Traffic going eastwards from the Crockerton roundabout towards Heytesbury has its own overtaking lane as the bridge is approached. This does have a double white line to stop traffic coming the other way using it too.
BUT, as Paul correctly pointed ouit in the first place, eastwards traffic passing under the bridge then sees ahead of it the over-taking lane for traffic coming the other way, but there is no double white line stopping eastwards traffic from using it too.
I'll have a lie down now .... and try to keep my fingers off the keyboard for a bit ....
Posted by: top, Westbury on 11:32am Tue 1 Apr 08
well lets just say its the driver that make any road dangerous.
well lets just say its the driver that make any road dangerous.
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